Amc 360 firing order. Melling camshafts supply the performance to suit your horsepower and torque requirements wherever and whenever you want it. Melling high performance camshafts are developed, engineered, tested and manufactured with the highest standards of quality and materials. Listed below is a group classification for the custom (or high) performance ...

In a stock-style distributor, where the trigger is inside the distributor, then it technically doesn't matter where the #1 post is, 2-o'clock, 7-o'clock, whatever. As long as the order is correct around the posts, it'll run OK. The real problem with #1 position is clearance of the vacuum advance so that you have adequate room to adjust timing.

Amc 360 firing order. Okay my 1970 amc 360 on my wagoneer firing order help! Okay I'm stumped it ran great with the distributor 180 off Well I rotated it correctly and put the plugs on to match the firing order and sooo many variants.

Thanks (0) Quote Reply Posted: May/21/2010 at 6:21am. With stock compression and heads, an RV cam is your best bet. Has a nice lope to it but makes good usable power from 1500-4500 rpm range. Advance the valve timing a few degrees to trick it into thinking it has some compression.

1) Disconnect the battery. 2) Remove all 8 spark plugs to make the engine easier to turn over by hand. 3) Put your thumb over the #1 spark plug hole and rotate the engine in the direction of normal running rotation with a socket wrench on the center crank pulley.Google AMC v-8 firing order for an image. #1 Cylinder is front, driver's side. 74 Hornet Hatchback X twins (since 1977) 62 American Convertible (still worth the $50 I spent in 1973!) AMCRC #513, AMO #384. 70 AMX 360 4-speed (since 1981) Hayes89.

CJ Runner Discussion starter · Feb 21, 2009. I have a 1978 CJ5 that I put a new remanufactured AMC 360 into. It has a holley 4160 (4bbl) and I've done the team rush upgrade. I bought the carb from someone else and rebuilt it. I timed the engine to 10*BTDC on the intake stroke. I poured fuel in the bowls through the fuel inlet coming off the ...Bump the motor around until your harmonic balancer is on 0 degrees and pull the # 1 plug out and check to see if the piston is at the top(top dead center)if not bump it around again and it should be on top,then pull your distributor cap off and see where your rotor button is at ,that is where you will start the firing order at 18436572 and go counter clockwise on the dist cap and you're done.AMC Apprentice Joined: Oct/06/2017 Location: Long beach Status: Offline Points: 51 Post Options. Post Reply. Quote Hayes89. Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Topic: 360 vacuum diagram? And fireing order? Posted: Jun/23/2020 at 12:12pm: Thank you ramblinrev . Members Profile. Send Private Message. Find Members Posts. Add to Buddy List. Moderator ...By the time you're finished, you won't need a book to tell the firing order of the engine - 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2! P.S. Zack suggests using a standard-length AMC V8 ignition wire set, with …front to rear with a firing order of 1-5-3-6-2-4. The crankshaft rotates in a counterclockwise direction, viewed from the rear of the engine. Seven two-piece main bearings are used to support the crankshaft and the camshaft is supported by four one-piece line bored bearings. Identification The Engine Code is located on a It shouldn't really matter where the #1 wire is on the distributor if the firing order is maintained, and the rotor points to #1 wire when the #1 piston is TDC (advance notwithstanding). The only problems it may cause is interference of the vacuum canister with the block and accessories when you try to adjust the timing or plug wires may be the ...Tags. 1973 - 1979 F-100 & Larger F-Series Trucks - Firing order on a 360 - Before I start my truck up, I want to make sure the plug wires are on correctly. I found this diagram on the internet and I want to make sure this is right. When I replaced the spark plugs, I took two wires off at the same time and then I forgot...Mar 4, 2001 · WILL · #5 · Mar 4, 2001. Number 1 cylinder is on the driver's side closest to the grill. Odd cylinders are on the drivers side and evens are on the passengers side. The connecting rods are numbered from front to back on the crankshaft is where that comes from. 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2 is the correct firing order. The firing order of a 4-cylinder engine depends on the engine’s design and the type of ignition system used. One common firing order for a 4-cylinder engine is 1-3-4-2. This means that the first cylinder to fire is cylinder 1, followed by cylinder 3, then cylinder 4, and finally cylinder 2.

Chrysler 360 firing order. Engines, Shafts, Steering, Struts, Rudders, etc. 9 posts • Page 1 of 1. wmgill Tin star Posts: 20 Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2015 12:46 am. ... CCW firing order given on info plate, and in engine manual is for the CW engine, and vise versa. HIATUS on Lake St. Clair 1990 32' Sedan Bridge Twin 360 Chrysler Marines. Top.Firing Order 1 - 8 - 4 - 3 - 6 - 5 - 7 - 2 Turn Distributor Counter Clockwise To Advance Timing • FIRING ORDER AND CYLINDER NUMBERING:For firing order and cylinder …About Us. Current Location in Santa Rosa, CA. Dimitri "Dema" Elgin began working in the area of automotive technology in 1957 (over six decades ago) and opened Elgin's Machine Shop in 1960. In 1985, he sold the shop to his employees so that he could devote his attention to his camshaft business, now called Elgin Cams.

Could anyone help me with the firing order for AMC 360 engine Purchased a non runner and hope to fire it up soon. It came form a 74 matador. Thanks. Top. rx4ord Old Hand Posts: 6853 Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 10:08 am Location: Tasmania! Tasmania! ... Firing Order AMC 360cid : 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2

Find JEEP 5.9L/360 AMC V8 Spark Plugs and get Free Shipping on Orders Over $109 at Summit Racing! Use your Summit Racing SpeedCard today, and get 10% back - Get Details! Vehicle/Engine Search Vehicle/Engine Search Make/Model Search ... Call To Order. This is a custom order part.

Quote Reply Topic: firing order Posted: Dec/06/2008 at 11:35pm: ... All AMC engines are 4 cycle and it is very, very easy to put the distributor in 180 degrees out of time. - Also, it is very likely that when you remove and replace the distributor the oil pump shaft will twist just enough during the removal and replacement that you can easily ...cherokee backfire problem. so i have a 79 cherokee with an amc 360 motor. it sat for about 2 years without being driven so there were some problems i had to address immediately. it had trouble starting and had a bad hesitation on acceleration. so i rebuilt the carb, which is an edelbrock 1406 with electric choke. after the rebuild it …1984 CJ 7, SBC 350TBI, 700R4, D 300, AMC 20, D30, 35" Mickeys, 3.54 Gears, 4" susp. Lift, 2" body lift. AMC 20 Write Up In Progress - 4.56 gears, Aussie Rear Locker, Moser 1 Piece Axles Coming Soon - CV Shafts, Welded Tubes, trussesThe Firing Order is extremely various when you compare engine types even within the same automotive manufacturers engine families. ... 318, 340, 360 A Engine. Pontiac: Oldsmobile: Plymouth: 265-455 V8: Generaton One: 277, 301, 303, 313, 318, 326 cid: Generation Two: AMC: No Data BoxWrench Products. Basic Engine Building DVD Over …AMC 401 V8 AMC 360 V8 AMC 304 V8 AMC 258 I6 AMC 232 I6 "Dauntless" 350 V8 "Dauntless" 225 V6 "Vigilante" 327 V8 "Tornado" 230 I6 Perkins 192 I4 "Hurricane" 226 I6 "Hurricane" 134 I4 "Go Devil" 134 I4. Engines: Upgrades Factory Options General: The F-Head 134 inline 4 was the standard engine in the CJ-5 and CJ-6 from their introduction until ...

Everyone seems to be in agreement initial timing should be in the 10-14 degrees. Disconnect vac advance. I was running a prestolite dizzy and welded up the advance plate to limit the advance to about 25 total. (let me know if you need more info on doing this). This was less than ideal for performance but worked to minimize detonation.It shouldn't really matter where the #1 wire is on the distributor if the firing order is maintained, and the rotor points to #1 wire when the #1 piston is TDC (advance notwithstanding). The only problems it may cause is interference of the vacuum canister with the block and accessories when you try to adjust the timing or plug wires may be the ...For an AMC V8 they should be 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2. For the Jeep I-6 CYL they should be marked in the firing order 1-5-3-6-2-4. Different engines makes have different firing orders, so you need to make sure what your particular firing order is. The firing order is factory stamped onto the intake manifold, so double check. Take the cap off.Firing order: 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2: Dimensions (L x W x H): - Cylinder block. The 360 Magnum engine has a cast-iron block with a five-bearings crankshaft supported system. The cylinder bore is 101.6 mm (4.00 in), piston stroke is 90.9 mm (3.58 in) and the compression ratio rating is 9.1:1. This motor has aluminum alloy pistons with two compression ...AMC Addicted Joined: Jul/05/2007 Location: Angier, N.C. Status: Offline Points: 10308 Post Options. Post Reply. Quote FuzzFace2. Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Topic: Firing order 360 5.9 Posted: Jul/14/2012 at 9:10pm: 7matador2 wrote: yup just checked that. order is correct. but for some reason still wont start. any suggestions? ...The firing order is cast into the intake manifold from the factory. The only thing in many cases you have to worry about is where the vacuum advance can ends up due to interference, so trial fit the distributor to place the vacuum advance can where you want it to be and then pick #1 so it looks right to you when finished.AMC Apprentice Joined: Sep/08/2009 Location: Alabama Status: Offline Points: 13 Post Options. Post Reply. Quote brody. Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Topic: 360 V8 QTS 4 Transmission and Firing Order Posted: Sep/18/2009 at 9:04am: Heyya Fellas ...This video demonstrates the firing interval of a 90 degree V4 engine with a crankpin offset of 180 degrees. Cylinder pairs 1&2 and 3&4 share a crankpin eachC..."First off, we really need to have you check your distributor placment, sounds like you my be firing the next plug in the firing order when the vacuum comes in (VERY POSSIBLE!). ... In my 84 with a bored over AMC 360 the rotor was out of phase. Maybe some one else can make it clearer to you. Maybe JeepHammer will try. 85 CJ7 w/AMC 304, ...Using this firing order, the #1 cylinder is opposite the #6 cylinder, and vice- versa (#6 is opposite #1). #8 is opposite #5, #4 is opposite #7, and #3 is opposite #2. Again, the firing order is required, and this ONLY works on V-type engines. For other engines, here are some common firing orders and their opposites.exhaust manifold amc 360 304 jeep 401 side passenger manifolds 1974 1972. Performer Manifolds idle to 5500 rpm Performer manifolds are dualplane, lowrise intake manifolds with a 180 firing order and patented It provides good torque and horsepower across it's rpm range. We installed on of these onto Mike's CJ5 which is equipped with an AMC 360 V8.Been reading a lot, but this is my first post. A few months ago I purchased a 1978 Jeep CJ7 that has an AMC 360 in it with 15K since a rebuild. Currently it has the following: - T150 tranny and Dana 20 t-case. It starts very easily when cold and is a bit harder to start when warm, but starts after about 4-5 crank revolutions.Thanks (0) Quote Reply Posted: Jan/13/2012 at 6:00pm. clockwise. 74 AMX, 401. Viper spec T56 6 speed trans. Hydroboost brakes with rear disks from a Avenger. 3:73 TG rear,now Trutrac with 3:15. A Turbo is in my future. FSJunkie. Members Profile. Maybe he's thinking the 360 is a "Mopar" 360 and not as tough as an AMC 304! Everything's pretty much the same except the 360 heads have much bigger valves. Im with billd 100%. the 304 and 360 have the same stroke. 360 has a bigger bore. and the 360 in stock form will out run a built up 304.Firing Order: 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2. You should be able to find the order listed on the intake, just below the front of the carb. Piston Numbering From Radiator To The Firewall: Driverside: 1,3,5,7 (1 is closest to the radiator) Passenger: 2,4,6,8 (2 is closest to the radiator) Trace your #1 piston spark plug wire from the engine to the distributor ...Gents, Need to figure out why my amc 304 isn’t firing right. I’ve looked up the firing order. I did a compression test on all the cylinders they all have compression. I took a head off (passenger side where cyl 2 and 8 are dead). I checked all the rockers and they are lifting. I bought a new HEI A-Power distributor that I put in today ...amc 360 timing trouble. 1093 Views 1 Reply 2 Participants Last post by 79BlackPearl, ... It will fire but backfire out of the carb. I have the firing order corret, and everything seems to be right. My question is does anyone know how to get the timing right if you don't make the distributor? please help. Thanks

Package one: Rebuilt 360 with factory crank and rods. Cast 9 to 1 compression flat top pistons. Heads are "308" swirl port heads from 1988-91, rebuilt with competition valve job and a slight mill to true up the surface. Camshaft is MP P4452759 .430"/.450" lift, 260/268 duration, 110 lsa, installed at 108 intake centerline.tgreese wrote: ↑ Thu May 04, 2023 1:05 pm Everything will work if you put the plug wires on in the right order, and the rotor points to the number 1 wire at TDC of number 1. Thus there are 8 different orientations for the distributor cap that will "work" and give you the proper timing and firing order. Use the orientation that Jeep suggests.Step 6. Compare the spark plug wires to the manual's firing order and make sure each wire is attached to the correct distributor terminal. Changing spark plugs requires more than just the ability to pull each one out and put a new one in the empty space. It is essential that they are rewired correctly before the engine is started.Before adjusting timing, remember to disconnect and plug the vacuum advance hose! By the time you're finished, you won't need a book to tell the firing order of the engine - 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2! P.S. Zack suggests using a standard-length AMC V8 ignition wire set, with HEI-style terminals installed.Quote Reply Topic: wiring spark plugs on amc 360 Posted: Oct/29/2010 at 12:39pm: whats the firing order so i can place the wires in the correct place. Amc Or go home! billd . Members Profile. Send Private Message. Find Members Posts. Add to Buddy List. Moderator Group Forum AdministratorFor reference, the firing order of the AMC V8 is 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2. The cylinders are numbered like a Chevrolet engine. The #1 cylinder is the front cylinder on the right hand side as you face the front of the vehicle with #3, #5 and #7 in a line towards the firewall. The #2 cylinder is in front on the left hand side with #4, #6 and #8 as you go ...Since then, the L prefix has been dropped, and Chrysler's entire line of 1964-and-later 273, 318, 340, and 360 V-8s became known as A-engines. The A-series engines were upgraded to Magnum form in ...

Using the traditional V8 firing order of GM, AMC, Mopar, and most Ford OHV V8s (1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2), a cross plane crankshaft will produce unevenly spaced firings within each side (or cylinder bank) but ensures there’s a balance between the two banks. This is what gives American muscle cars that distinctive burbling sound, although there is …Your Vacuum Advance Nipple should be pointing at the drivers side headlight back and the firing order should be 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2 CLOCKWISE. Number one cylinder is the front cylinder on the driver side, closest to the radiator. They are numbered front to rear 1-3-5-7. The passenger side is 2-4-6-8 again, front to rear.As long as the firing order is right, you can put the dizzy in backwards on TDC and start your firing order where the rotor is pointing. If it was running like that before, it will probably be just fine. ... AMC 20 3.15. 1973 AMC Ambassador: 360 4V, TC-727. 1966 AMC Marlin 327 4V, T-10 4 speed, AMC 20 Powr-lok 3.54. Top. 4 posts • Page 1 of 1.Duraspark. The Duraspark II is a Ford electronic ignition system . Ford Motor Company began using electronic ignitions in 1973 with the Duraspark electronic ignition system and introduced the Duraspark II system in 1976. The biggest change, apart from the control box redesign, was the large distributor cap to handle the increased spark energy.carwallps.comAll the books and diagrams show a common firing order...but! their is a #1 stamped next to the spark plug closest to the passenger. If that were #1... Home. Forums. New posts Recent Posts Search ... 360 LA firing order confusion. Thread starter chieftian; Start date Nov 10, 2014; Nov 10, 2014 #1 C. chieftian Active Member. Local time 9:47 PM ...Firing Order of Most Domestic V8 Engines by Diagram. ... AMC for most V8 engines: AMC for most V8 engines: Rotation: Clockwise Firing Order: 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2Could anyone help me with the firing order for AMC 360 engine Purchased a non runner and hope to fire it up soon. It came form a 74 matador. Thanks. Top. rx4ord Old Hand Posts: 6853 Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 10:08 am Location: Tasmania! Tasmania! ... Firing Order AMC 360cid : 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2Ford V8 Engines - 8 Cylinder Engines manufactured by Ford. Ford 351 Cleveland V8 Engines - 351 cubic inch V8 Engines manufactured by Ford. AMC V8 Engines - From GEN-1 Nash/Hudson/Rambler V-8s (1956-1966) through to the GEN-3 AMC Tall-deck (1970-1991) AMC V8 hp/Torque, Compression & Bore/Stroke by year.Could anyone help me with the firing order for AMC 360 engine Purchased a non runner and hope to fire it up soon. It came form a 74 matador. Thanks. Top. rx4ord Old Hand Posts: 6853 Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 10:08 am Location: Tasmania! Tasmania! ... Firing Order AMC 360cid : 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2tgreese wrote: ↑ Thu May 04, 2023 1:05 pm Everything will work if you put the plug wires on in the right order, and the rotor points to the number 1 wire at TDC of number 1. Thus there are 8 different orientations for the distributor cap that will "work" and give you the proper timing and firing order. Use the orientation that Jeep suggests.However, many piston heads consider engine sound an essential part of engine design, understandably so! Most 4-cylinder engines have a firing order of 1-3-4-2 although other firing orders such as 1-3-2-4, 1-4-3-2, 1-2-4-3 are possible. Consider the inline 4 engine in Figure 1. The cylinders are usually numbered 1234 from the front of the …Gents, Need to figure out why my amc 304 isn’t firing right. I’ve looked up the firing order. I did a compression test on all the cylinders they all have compression. I took a head off (passenger side where cyl 2 and 8 are dead). I checked all the rockers and they are lifting. I bought a new HEI A-Power distributor that I put in today ...Everyone seems to be in agreement initial timing should be in the 10-14 degrees. Disconnect vac advance. I was running a prestolite dizzy and welded up the advance plate to limit the advance to about 25 total. (let me know if you need more info on doing this). This was less than ideal for performance but worked to minimize detonation.They have to go back in the same location relative to the camshaft. We then pulled the camshaft out, making sure not to damage the bearings. We also pulled the oil pan to reseal the part. Next we ...To adjust hydraulic lifters two fingers spin the pushrod as the lock nut is gently tightened. When resistance is felt on the pushrod, that's zero lash. The adjuster is tightened to specs then the ...If the dizzy has say 24 deg max mech adv, then 10 to 16 Initial Advance should be ok. Goal is 34 to 40 degrees total Initial and Mechanical Advance combined, No Vacuum Advance included. Need to make sure no Mech Adv is starting to come in at idle. when sitting the Initial timing.My "360" in my '72 Javelin (not original) is really a 5.9 which makes it a jeep engine I guess. I do not know what year it is. I was looking at the TSM for the '72 Javelin and it looks like the firing order of the '72 Javelin 360 is different then my 5.9L, at least my current firing order is different then what the TSM says a '72 should be is this correct?

1958 - 1984 International Harvester 345 C.I. 5.6L OHV 2v V8; 345A; Iron Engine Block; Iron Cylinder Heads; Bore 3.88"; Stroke 3.66"; Compression Ratio 8.05:1; Firing Order 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2; Recessed Spark Plugs; Front Motor Mounts; Shipped with Oil Kit; Horsepower 198 @ 4200 rpm; Torque 310 @ 2400 rpm; Professional Installation Recommended ...

Gents, Need to figure out why my amc 304 isn't firing right. I've looked up the firing order. I did a compression test on all the cylinders they all have compression. I took a head off (passenger side where cyl 2 and 8 are dead). I checked all the rockers and they are lifting. I bought a new HEI A-Power distributor that I put in today ...

wiring spark plugs on amc 360. whats the firing order so i can place the wires in the correct place. Amc Or go home! #1 goes to the front of the car IF it's bone-stock, vacuum advance pointing to the left, driver side fender. odd on left, even on right of car. Firing order SHOULD be cast into the intake...unless someone ground it off, or unless ...For the best performing and Highest Quality crate engines available, please call, fax or email us for more information or to place your order. CALL: (800)-903-6446 (800-90-ENGINE) OR CALL: (803)-275-2549Firing Order AMC 360cid : 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2 Distributor Rotation : Clockwise Drivers Side cylinder numbering (front to back) : 1 3 5 7 Passenger Side cylinders numbering (front to back) : 2 4 6 8 1) Disconnect the battery. 2) Remove all 8 spark plugs to make the engine easier to turn over by hand.We would like to show you a description here but the site won't allow us.Firing Order of Most Domestic V8 Engines by Diagram. info Home; Sign In; 4x4 Tire Tech; The Garage; Mud Tire Reviews; Find Trails; Event Coverage ... Firing Order: 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2 AMC V8 hp/Torque, Compression & Bore/Stroke : Buick Engines except HEI: Buick Engines for most except HEI: Rotation: Clockwise Firing Order ...animation of straight 6 cylinder firing order. most straight 6's use this firing order, 2JZ, RB26, Slant 6, etc. please check your particular engines firing ...Step 4. Get your timing light and connect the tool's red clip to the positive (red cable) battery terminal and the tool's black clip to the negative (black cable) battery terminal. Hook the timing light clamp-on clip to the number one spark plug wire on the engine. If you stand if front of the engine, facing the drive belts, the number one plug ...The seventh symbol was a letter designating engine type as follows: P = 360 cid V-8 four-barrel; and X=390 cid V-8 four-barrel. The following group of symbols was the sequential Serial Number and began with 100001 for cars built in Kenosha, Wis. and 700001 for cars built in Brampton, Ontario, Canada.

att yahoo homepagepower outage in restongood sam rewards cardnikki sami tori knotek today pictures Amc 360 firing order lowe's home improvement muscle shoals products [email protected] & Mobile Support 1-888-750-6959 Domestic Sales 1-800-221-6564 International Sales 1-800-241-3396 Packages 1-800-800-2447 Representatives 1-800-323-2459 Assistance 1-404-209-8992. Quote Reply Topic: firing order Posted: Dec/06/2008 at 11:35pm I had the opporutunity to help a fellow amcer diagnose and mostly resolve a vibration problem on a freshly rebuilt engine today and wanted to take a moment to remind everyone of a few things that can really be tough to find if you don't know what to look for.. la models direct The firing order is 1 5 3 6 2 4. the dist rotor goes ccw. good luck. 3 people found this helpful. Mark helpful. 34,015 Report; lrodri911 answered 2 years ago ... from what i belive is the car had a 360 engine amc ralley wheels dual exhaust posi trec rear end 2 door coupe and i think a stock hood scoop very very fast vehicle. 1970 AMC Hornet-The firing order must be considered on the basis of engine vibrations and engine cooling. Also the firing order affects the balancing of the engine. Reasons for preferring 1-3-4-2 than the 1-2-3-4 in 4 cylinder engine: 1. The power impulses are evenly distributed and are 180 degrees apart. Therefore the firing order for the engine is 1-3-4-2. ww charmschasing echoes walkthrough The Firing Order is extremely various when you compare engine types even within the same automotive manufacturers engine families. ... 318, 340, 360 A Engine. Pontiac: Oldsmobile: Plymouth: 265-455 V8: Generaton One: 277, 301, 303, 313, 318, 326 cid: Generation Two: AMC: No Data BoxWrench Products. Basic Engine Building DVD Over … deborah mays obituaryrise up math playground New Customers Can Take an Extra 30% off. There are a wide variety of options. How to fix: Get the engine so the #1 cylinder is in firing position. Then pop off the cap and see where the rotor is. Take the distributor out and put it back in so the …The firing order, which should be cast into the intake manifold, for the chevy small block V8 is 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2. The firing order is the numerical sequence in which the spark plugs are fired. The insertion position of each spark plug wire around the circumference of the distributor cap can be found according to a clock face.Firing order: 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2: Dimensions (L x W x H): - Cylinder block. The 360 Magnum engine has a cast-iron block with a five-bearings crankshaft supported system. The cylinder bore is 101.6 mm (4.00 in), piston stroke is 90.9 mm (3.58 in) and the compression ratio rating is 9.1:1. This motor has aluminum alloy pistons with two compression ...